Freedom Lifestyle

We Went Viral Over a Fish: Toxic Masculinity, Homophobia and Social Media Trolls [Jared Schachter]

• Sam Laliberte • Season 6 • Episode 78

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My husband and I went viral on Instagram and it’s not pretty. 6.6 million views, 125k shares, 30k comments and counting. 

We're opening up about how an otherwise ordinary day in Squamish led to us becoming accidental internet sensations. Our infamous fish video has received media misinterpretation and mocking comments about Jared's masculinity, sexuality and our naivety. It's a fascinating look at how quickly and wildly things can spiral in the world of social media.

Highlights: 

- the reality of the online backlash and public ridicule Jared has withstood
- we delve into the multiple theories behind our viral video 
- lessons we've gleaned about ourselves amidst this chaos.

My husband, Jared, breaks his silence by responding to the haters while attempting to make sense of his recent virality, trolling and internet fame.

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About the show:

Sam Laliberte -  entrepreneur, digital nomad and freedom seeker, hosts the Freedom Lifestyle Podcast to expose people to the many ways you can design your dream life and unlock your own version of the freedom lifestyle. Her guests have empowered themselves through flexible work as a way to “have it all” - financial, location AND schedule freedom.

Speaker 1:

The person who's reacting to you or making fun of you. It's their own problem. Somebody who's secure and happy and healthy as a person, in my opinion, wouldn't feel the need to put somebody else down. I wanted to reply being like I literally can't believe you're spending your time reacting, throwing yourself reacting to this video. That was like as far as it got.

Speaker 2:

You're listening to the Freedom Lifestyle podcast series. I'm sharing relatable stories of freedom seekers who ditched conventional office life and courageously asked for more. The energy just completely shifted. My entire being just felt so free. My business was still generating income while I was on the beach.

Speaker 1:

I decided to quit and just stay at home. I really can't work for anyone but me.

Speaker 2:

It's literally just doing whatever the hell you want to do. As for me, I'm your host, sam, and I've spent the last four years creating a business that allows me to work from anywhere. The Freedom Lifestyle looks different for everyone. What's your free? This episode of the Freedom Lifestyle podcast is going to sound a little bit different than the rest because I have invited my husband, jared, to be a guest in this week's episode.

Speaker 2:

Now, jared being on the podcast isn't new. He's actually been part of our top rated episodes and the most downloaded episodes. People really love when he comes on and spills the tea about our relationship, our lives or our freedom. This time, the hot seat is really on him because about a month ago, I posted an Instagram video, a reel, that went viral At the time of recording this. The video has had over 6.4 million views, over 120,000 people have shared it to their stories and almost 30,000 people have commented on it. Now, when I say 30,000 people have commented on it, they're not saying nice things.

Speaker 2:

My husband Jared has been completely ridiculed in these comments. They have questioned his masculinity, his sexuality, the integrity of our marriage, his soy consumption, what vehicle he drives you name it. His political views have all been scrutinized at scale on the internet. If you haven't watched the video, please go watch it. Why not? Everyone else is watching it. I've put a link to it in the show notes or it's just tagged in my Instagram reels. We saved a fish. That's what the video was about. It's literally a video of Jared and I walking in the woods in Squamish and coming across a fish who is now stranded in a puddle that's evaporating, and we help it get back to the flowing river so hopefully it can spawn, lay its eggs, which it is attempting to swim upstream to do. Of course, I've learned a lot about science. I've learned a lot about fish and salmon and a bunch of BS about what it means to be a man.

Speaker 2:

This entire time, jared has not responded. He hasn't even liked a single comment. He hasn't responded to a single piece of hate or online bullying. If you go in his Instagram DMs, he is flooded with personal DMs of people going out of their way, writing him novels, making fun of him, making fun of him, ridiculing him, telling him he must be gay. My theory I think a lot of these people would love for Jared to be gay and I don't blame them. Jared is a babe. Jared is a catch, no pun intended. So we got the exclusive here for the Freedom Lifestyle. For the first time, jared is breaking his silence and responding to what he thinks about all these haters questioning his manliness, his sexuality and his ability to catch a fish. So, with no further delay, here's Jared. Jared, welcome back to the Freedom Lifestyle podcast. How is your evening going so far?

Speaker 1:

It's going great. Thank you so much for having me, Sam. It's a pleasure as always. What an honor.

Speaker 2:

I'm so excited that you're going to break your silence over the fish video. Should we start with your favorite drink though Bud Light.

Speaker 1:

I think we need to Okay let's crack it.

Speaker 2:

I think this will help. I'm going to get you to tap into your emotions today. Are you ready for that?

Speaker 1:

I'll do my best, no guarantees.

Speaker 2:

You're going to be great At this point. The audience knows a little bit about the fish video, the virality of it, the scale of it, but what I haven't really talked about is all the theories people have. Some people think that we are city slickers who were in the woods for the day on a hike. Some people think that we staged the whole video, we put the fish there, and all in an effort to create content. Some people just can't even believe that you would allow me to post this. They think that I must have created this video behind your back because it's just so embarrassing, and so I thought we could start by setting the record straight of what actually happened that day. So what do you remember from this infamous walk in the woods where we saved this fish? Lay out the scene for us.

Speaker 1:

Well, it's early fall, late summer here in Squamish, and we were going for our usual walk. We do the same walk every day, except our walk got more and more filled with death, and that's the death of thousands of fish, and if you can imagine what it smelled like, it was that and worse, and there was carcasses everywhere. Some carcasses were still alive, but their eyes were being eaten out by birds. It was a complete blood bath and we felt bad about it and we wanted to help.

Speaker 2:

So there's essentially a flowing river, maybe five minutes from our house, and this is a walk that we do five or six days a week easily. It's our circuit. It's a 30 minute walk and most of the year it's just a normal beautiful walk. But this time of year we've now learned salmon are heading upstream to spawn, to lay their babies, and prior to this day we had been seeing more and more fish dying and we didn't really know what was going on. We have to admit, like we didn't know about spawning fish or anything like that, we know quite a bit now.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so this particular day we actually brought out, as you can see in the video, a bread bag with some bread in it to try to feed some of the fish who were clearly suffering.

Speaker 2:

We thought that it would give them more energy we thought they needed.

Speaker 1:

they were struggling to go upstream, they'd give up on life, yeah, like we'd watch them swim and then all of a sudden they'd give up and just belly over, like constantly. So we felt like they needed some carbohydrates to ease their journey. And we're trying to save the fish and we saw this one particular fish, which wasn't an especially dire situation, and we felt like we could help.

Speaker 2:

And in terms of the videography of it and actually capturing the moment, there wasn't even any discussion. But that's kind of us, definitely led by me. It's very natural for me to just whip up my phone and videotape us when I just know something ridiculous is about to go down. And of course, I had no idea that I was about to create my first viral video. I had no scene ahead of me. All I knew is there was a fish in a puddle and the puddle was fairly close to the river. You saw in the video I maybe had to run for 10 seconds to get to it, but we now had to get this fish from the puddle to the river and I was tasking you with the job. So what's going on in your mind at this point where I'm now Jared? You got to save this fish.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, let's try to save the fish. And then I tried to pick it up and it was clearly unable to. And I don't know if you've ever tried to pick you. You still haven't tried to pick up the fish, like you put into the bread bag, which was a creative solution. But you're picking up a fish. It's a lot harder than it looks. Obviously, some of the haters have picked up a fish or many fish. It seems like they had a lot of feedback on how it was trying to do it, but they're pretty strong, like in terms of how much they flap and scaly and slimy, and I didn't want to hurt the fish. And well, I guess I'll say I didn't want to hurt the fish, but I also found it gross and let it go and that's where you stepped in.

Speaker 2:

At this point we couldn't walk away. It was gasping for air, it seemed, it was in dire need of a bigger pond and we could not walk away. We could not watch this fish die in front of us. And so, yeah, like a fight or flight kind of went off in me. We have the bread bag. Okay, grab a stick, put it in the bread bag, fill it with water, run the fish over, and at that point you just start videotaping me again. I didn't ask you to videotape me. We did not have some skit in mind. What was overcoming you? Why did you just naturally think, oh, I need to videotape this back now?

Speaker 1:

I mean years of dating. You've proved that if you have any doubts, just turn on the camera. So it was pretty ingrained and really didn't take a lot of thought.

Speaker 2:

Okay, so that is what went down. We saved the fish. The fish gets back into the river, beg or pond, swims away. We're feeling like heroes. We're feeling really good about ourselves. We're walking home so excited, high energy, high fiving each other, feeling like we just did something great. Also, as we're walking home, of course, rewatching some of the videos and laughing hysterically at ourselves at both of ourselves, because we looked pretty pathetic.

Speaker 2:

And about a year or two prior to this, we had created a video that is similar in nature the Squirrel video, and it's a video where I'm telling you to feed a squirrel and you don't want to feed a squirrel, and a lot of people thought that video was hilarious. We had multiple people ask us to send it to them directly. People asked us to post it on Instagram, not just on our stories, that they can watch it over and over. Your family in particular loved it. So at this point, I'm like, hey, maybe we have another Squirrel video, and I immediately go into content creation mode. I get home and I'm clipping the series of video clips together, turning it into a reel, playing with different speed up features and having a lot of fun with it. At this point, what is going on in your mind. Is there any part of you that is feeling embarrassed by anything you're seeing in the video or hesitant to me posting this?

Speaker 1:

I didn't really think much of it. I mean, you just kind of went on the couch and were fiddling around on your phone for a while and then came out with the video and it didn't even cross my mind that you wouldn't post it If you didn't want to. It seemed hilarious to me. I didn't think it would be get that type of reaction, but I thought it was funny.

Speaker 2:

Did you feel that if you asked me not to post it, I would respect that?

Speaker 1:

I think so. I don't know if I would respect myself, though, but Well, I appreciate you letting me post it.

Speaker 2:

If you could go back now, would you have still let me post it? Yeah, I still don't understand the big deal, and I think it's pretty funny. Would you know how to save a fish now? Because you didn't, you gave up. Could you do it now? I mean, if I had the bread bag.

Speaker 1:

I would go that route. I still don't know about putting my Supposedly you're supposed to put your thumb into its mouth.

Speaker 2:

Do it skills. Yeah, do it skills.

Speaker 1:

I actually don't know if I'd be that much more well equipped, Knowing the backlash and outrage that might come. I might be slightly more motivated to perform the next time, but I'm not sure I'd be that much more well equipped without a stick and a bread bag.

Speaker 2:

Stick and a bread bag and just two people with big hearts trying to save a fish. That's all there was folks, nothing more than that, but nonetheless we posted it. It went viral pretty much immediately, within 24 hours, and it already had tens of thousands of views and at this time, my highest Instagram real view count was 15,000. And so we knew pretty much right away that something is happening. This is weird, this is strange, and along with those immediate views was the immediate comments of hate and ridicule. It started kind of gentle. It was, you know, this man's a plus for not being able to save a fish or being scared of a fish, and this man's a plus quickly evolved to this is not a real man. And then it went okay, this is a real man, but this is a man that's actually gay. And then it went to okay, this is a man who's gay, who can't protect his family and his wife needs to leave him immediately and we need to save her. From your perspective, why?

Speaker 1:

let's not forget, also a Biden voter.

Speaker 2:

An average liberal, that's true. Why do you think this video struck such a chord in so many people that it had this type of reaction?

Speaker 1:

I've been thinking about this and I still haven't totally figured out or come to terms with it. The closest thing I can relate it to and what I've been trying to think about it is like why are people upset at somebody being gay or being a different religion or being from a different country, and that somebody who's acting or looks or can be perceived as different than them causes fear and outrage? I don't understand why, other than for the fact that maybe it means that something they don't know is scary to them, because something they don't know could usurp or change their particular place in life or what they've gained, or their stature. So then I'm like well, these white males, maybe it would be so upset about it, but then it was all different types of people. It wasn't just like white males who are sometimes see themselves at the top of this social hierarchy or whatever that could get put down a peg. It was also women, also people of color, all different races, it seemed.

Speaker 2:

There were also gay men in the comments saying we don't want him as a gay man. We don't take him, he's not gay.

Speaker 1:

So I think it comes down to people being angered by or upset by people who are different than them. I mean, I also noticed it in myself. If somebody is doing something, that is, I perceive it against my values, usually it's actually harming, harmful or harming others. In this case, I'm not harming or harming others, so it's a little bit different. But I can still feel myself getting annoyed or angry by somebody who I feel like is acting outside of value. So I mean, that's the closest thing I can equate it to, with the main difference being in what's so surprising about it. It's not really like hurting them or anyone else. It's just a person who's incapable of picking up what I perceive to be a large and aggressive fish.

Speaker 2:

It was aggressive. No, it wasn't aggressive.

Speaker 1:

Well, by the time, it was supposed to go in the bread bag. It was quite tired from us battling each other. I want to all set their record straight on that.

Speaker 2:

That what.

Speaker 1:

I tired it out by trying to pick it up, and then it was oh got it, got it.

Speaker 2:

No, it was a team effort. I agree. I agree.

Speaker 1:

We could all hear you. I appreciate you talking to me about that, yeah, supporting me in the background.

Speaker 2:

Okay, the most common comment is that's not a man. Man card revoked. I'm not sure he ever had a man card. Oh, that's true. Ha ha ha. Not a man. Not a man. Not a man, that's a woman. I looked at the definition of masculinity, also known as manhood or manliness. It's a set of attributes, behaviors and roles associated with men and boys, and it theoretically can be understood as socially constructed Traits traditionally viewed as masculine in Western society include strength, courage, independence, leadership and assertiveness. With all that said, we know there's a growing movement of men who are rejecting society's more rigid definitions of what manliness is and are really redefining what it means to be a man. Do you feel like you're part of this movement?

Speaker 1:

I definitely am in terms of my actions and I'm not out there trying to make a statement, but I've realized more and more that by some of the choices I'm making and ways I'm being, I'm definitely making a statement about what it means to be A confident man and not trying to fit into societal norms of what that might mean. And to me, the ability to step outside of the norm can only be authentically done if you're confident in yourself and my manhood so like. To me, the ability to do things that might seem traditionally unmanly Without care concern demonstrates that I'm comfortable with who I am and whatever my definition of masculinity is, whether I care about that or not.

Speaker 2:

I've never heard you claim that before, but I have always found it interesting this dynamic that we have where, whenever we go to music festivals or to events where there's themes and people are supposed to dress a certain way, you basically wear my clothing. So of course it's feminine. You're wearing my outfits and I would always get comments from my friends and my family being like oh wow, jared is such a great sport, he lets you dress him up. Meanwhile, you are the one who asks to wear my clothes. You're the one who's going through my festival. Been correct.

Speaker 1:

It's true and I haven't really claimed that before, because I haven't really Been put in a position to think about whether I'm claiming it and I think this video and the reaction to it and some of the conversations we've had have demonstrated to me that it's important for me to not be I wouldn't even say not be ashamed that's not the right word but because I'm not like to actually claim more vocally or Put it out there more that there needs to be a different way, because I find that the old ways of being or putting people into a particular box just makes zero sense, and what makes even less sense is being scared of people who don't want to be in that box as well. So Part of this process has shown to me that people need more of a voice and more of a demonstration that there's different ways of being in the world, and that's totally good and more than good. It's great.

Speaker 2:

Do you know when you started to? Well, we know that it's. It's as of late that you started to really see yourself as a changemaker and see yourself as part of this movement of men reclaiming what manliness is and what it means to be a man. But do you even know how this started or how you even got to this point? Because when I look back at photos of you from music festivals and parties before us, you were dressing pretty manly. You weren't wearing dresses, you weren't wearing makeup, you didn't do your nails sometimes or get your ears pierced or all these things that are just so normal about how Jared gets ready for events. Was there any type of moments where maybe you felt like this needed to be reclaimed? Did you ever feel that manliness and the definitions of it were a problem, that you had to start intentionally acting this way, or how did this even start?

Speaker 1:

Well, we can definitely thank my two sisters for the beginnings of my cross dressing.

Speaker 1:

When I was young they dressed me up as a girl more than once and would put makeup on me sometimes and I even remember when I was a kid I kind of pretended like I didn't like it, but I also did think it was fun and I like the attention that I got and I thought it was hilarious.

Speaker 1:

And then I'm sure what happened over time is obviously I mean, I got older, they weren't dressing me up anymore and then when you're younger and you're going through your teens and early twenties, like different is not a good thing a lot of the time. So I wanted to portray the typical societal standards of manliness and more, more typical stuff and try to work on my muscles and it wasn't really like a conscious choice to change it up, I think just over time, feeling more comfortable with who I am, finding it actually Rewarding experience to be different and I like having people comment and be like what are you doing? It's like validating, to not have to care about what other people think. So it's like self promoting in that sense, and I think it's just kind of grown over time and I just have more and more fun with it and enjoy being different.

Speaker 2:

So and you get that. Some people message you saying what are you doing?

Speaker 1:

Sometimes people will comment, being like I'm surprised you're wearing that or whatever less and less now, just because most of our Friends and the people that I'm associated with may or may not do the same thing, but if they're not doing the same thing, think it's great, and the people who don't think it's a great thing. We usually have less in common and I'm spending less time With them, which is its own problem in that, as we notice, with this video we're kind of living in our own little chamber because we found it so shocking what people are getting upset with. But yeah, so started with my sisters, took a hiatus because society said it wasn't what you should be doing and then, once I started to make my own first principles decisions, I think it's pretty funny, like a few times a year when I'm trying to have fun, like why not?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, dresses and leggings are comfy, yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah toxic masculinity is another term that I looked up because that was prevalent in the comments and I know friends who checked in on me mentioned that, like this is textbook toxic masculinity, which refers to the notion that some people's idea of manliness perpetuates domination, homophobia, aggression, and it often involves cultural pressures for men to behave a certain way. Another big theme in the comments was around your sexuality. So in one point it was this isn't a real man. And then other people are okay, this is a man, but this man can't possibly be married to a woman and being in a heterosexual relationship. This is clearly a closeted gay. One of the comments is another happy lesbian couple saving lives that received almost 150,000 likes one month in. Another one is I refuse to believe this man isn't gay, like there's no way that has over 20,000 likes. And then the most common one that has just been over and over again is you both need to start seeing other men.

Speaker 2:

So now I want to talk a little bit about the sexuality component and and be honest about my experience on the other end of this, because, well, you were getting messages and hate and comments. I was also getting dams from complete strangers at scale, messaging me being like, oh my God, how do you not know, girlfriend, he's gay. I'm warning you like, get out of there, you're going to get screwed over. He has a boyfriend on the side. Like, be careful, be careful. And I have to admit, when that many people message you something like that, no matter how secure you are in yourself, like it can raise some doubts and you and I were separated and I distinctly remember our phone call and I had said to you I just said keep it, you're, you're. How do you know you're not gay? Like you're not gay, right? Do you remember this? I do remember that, yeah. How did you feel when even your own wife was now questioning your sexuality?

Speaker 1:

I guess the main thing is like people are surprised sometimes that so the people that I were now spending more time with you, are more accepting of the times that I choose to wear women's clothes, will sometimes ask where I land on the, the sexual spectrum, and are surprised to hear that I'm Straight and quite straight, like I haven't really experimented in the other direction, not even haven't really like I haven't experimented the other direction, haven't been called to. So for me it's like I mean I'm in my 30s. Now I think I would know whether I was gay or not. I mean things can change over time, I'm not sure, but I would be shocked if I ever swing to the. I mean, it is a spectrum, but I'd be very shocked if I swing to the other end of the spectrum.

Speaker 1:

So I know myself well enough and I think that's part of the reason why, knowing myself, I feel comfortable Doing things that might have others call into question my behavior, because I know who I am, and it's a good feeling.

Speaker 2:

Why do you think people were making the connection between what was happening in the video and your sexuality? Because that's what you said to me. You're like Sam. First of all, this is nothing to do with sexuality. Someone who's able to grab her fish or not does not mean they're gay or straight or anything, and that's actually when I was hit with. Okay, yes, duh, sorry, I got sucked into these comments. I'm not gonna look at the comments tomorrow and I would have to give myself these boundaries because it was affecting me a lot More than you, and I do want to get into how you were able to be not as affected, at least seemingly so. But can we just try to understand why they are making this connection between your sexuality and your ability to grab a fish?

Speaker 1:

I mean, it's the same thing is why a man should be able to grab a fish instead of a woman. People in Society put people based on one characteristic into a particular box and feel that everyone in that box should act in a particular way. So gay men, the box is womanly, not outdoorsy, effeminate, so by Demonstrating. So then there's like they've made two jumps. So someone who looks like a man being effeminate Means that then they're now associated with being gay. So like there's kind of like two layers here happening, where it's like the toxic masculinity man should act a certain way, and then if the man's not acting a certain way, they're like a woman. And then if a man, who's someone who looks like a man, is acting like a woman, then they must be gay.

Speaker 1:

So you're like making these multi connections here and I guess that's where they got it from. But yeah, it's kind of hilarious and I feel bad for Like shout out to gay guys, like not all of them are the way people describe them. Like I have a lot of gay friends who would be very easily able to pick up that fish and Do all the manly things that I can't do. So it's actually an insult to gay people as well as myself To say that I should be gay just because I had trouble picking up the hopeless fish.

Speaker 2:

And I think that's why we saw in the comments as a gay man, we don't accept him. I can get fish, I can hunt. This is nothing to do with sexuality, because, yeah, we have a lot of friends who identify as gay, homosexual, and they're super manly, way manlier, traditionally manlier than us, and it really has nothing to do with it. Another word I had to look up was cuck. I don't even know if I'm saying that right, but cuck, cuck, cuck. We saw over and over again. Cuck is somebody who finds sexual pleasure in their partner having intercourse with people that are not them. So you portrayed yourself as a cuck by not being able to grab a fish. That's the connection we're now making here.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that was news to me. I'd heard the word cuck before. In fact, I'd actually been told I was cucked at some point in the past and I thought it just meant like lacking in masculine sexuality, essentially, so news to me that it actually meant something a bit more specific than that.

Speaker 2:

So when someone told you you were cucked in the past, what did they mean?

Speaker 1:

I thought it was like why aren't you more of a sexual masculine man, who won't, who would want to do something like go watch strippers or like this type of thing? You're cocked.

Speaker 2:

Hmm, sounds like toxic masculinity.

Speaker 1:

Sounds like it.

Speaker 2:

So can you set the record straight? Would you consider yourself a cuck?

Speaker 1:

So a cuck is. If I were to enjoy watching you have sex with somebody else, then I would not call myself a cuck under that definition. Now Okay.

Speaker 2:

Is there anything wrong with that, though? Because I mean, if I'm being a hundred percent honest, I'm putting you on the hot seat. I think that could be kind of hot, like the idea of you hooking up with someone and me watching you Get pleasure and enjoying that. We haven't tried it. I haven't tried it with anybody, but I actually maybe I'm a cuck. Is there anything wrong with that?

Speaker 1:

No, I mean to each their own in terms of exploring their own sexuality and what brings them joy and pleasure. Maybe I am a cock, I don't know. I haven't really thought about it, it hasn't crossed my mind, but I mean we can talk about it. It sounds like you might want to.

Speaker 2:

You never know. You got to keep things interesting seven years in, okay, so many comments. Your sexuality, your manliness, your sexual preferences, your political stance, your Soy consumption, everything has been on the table, with very few people coming to your defense. There was some, and we're gonna get to that, but why haven't you asked me to take it down with all of this hate that you're receiving?

Speaker 1:

Who doesn't like being famous. You know it's the American dream and we're living our own small version of it, so I'll take what I can get.

Speaker 2:

Honesty, I appreciate that I really do okay, simple and I guess to expand more.

Speaker 1:

I do appreciate, and think it's hilarious, the conversations it's created and the Discussions that I've had with people about it, and it also does. I mean it supports what you're trying to do. You've gotten some new followers. We've had a new experience of what it's like to go live. I can see what these other famous people are saying around. It's a brutal world out there with, like the Trolls. I haven't really experienced the trolls before and I mean we have a degree of separation so I can. It's like I'm an observer. I don't know these people and it's been pretty hilarious to me. It's no brainer to keep it out.

Speaker 2:

You've taken it all with stride. You've Found it funny, you've? I've woke up to messages when we've hit another million threshold like, oh my gosh, we're at three million now, for we're gonna get to ten. You're very Excited about it in a sense. If you're being Totally honest with yourself, have there been any comments that when you read them, they, they did hurt, or are you just truly completely unaffected by all of this?

Speaker 1:

I did spend a while at the beginning trying to understand if I'm having some sort of weird defense mechanisms To prevent me from feeling hurt around it, and so far I haven't uncovered any. I think the reasons why I'm not upset by it are it's something that's not in an area that I take pride in, so like if it had something to do with public speaking or Running a business or like some epic failure in that sense, I think I would be much more hurt by the comments I also have. Anyone close to me has mentioned that they think it's ridiculous and Probably would be in the same boat in terms of their inability to handle the hopeless fish. So that also gives me a sense of comfort and I had a twinge watching that guy's reaction video. There's a couple reaction video. Watching that guys reaction video I want like probably like the third time I watched it because I was trying to put someone, because it's just like ridiculous and hilarious that somebody Would spend their time and energy Reacting to me trying to pick up a fish.

Speaker 2:

Can you explain what a reaction video is to those who might not know what you're talking about?

Speaker 1:

Well, basically you react to watching the video with your own commentary, so it's like it's a video of someone watching our video.

Speaker 1:

It's a video of someone watching a video and then commenting. The man is like almost to a tee, exactly what you would imagine. Someone who it gets angry at the video might look like he has mutton chops. It's large, he's. He's filming the video in an insanely lot massive home gym with all of the weights per item in the squat rack and I Don't think I was upset. I just I actually like he's just so far removed from anyone who I could associate myself with. That, yeah, like I didn't even really get upset by it. Part of me was like angry at him, being like I wanted to reply, being like I literally can't believe you're spending your time reacting like filming yourself, reacting to this video. That was like as far as it got, so I didn't really get any more angry than that or annoyed or sad.

Speaker 2:

Well, good for you for not even responding. I've definitely found myself responding to a comment or two over the last month. I can't help it. Some of them just really bother me. Some of them I'm just feeling sassy one day and I want to just mess with them more with some of their comments. Oh, I bet they drive a Subaru and you know responding with what we actually drive or just silly things like that, to just like egg them on.

Speaker 1:

There could be. I thought about it Like maybe there is something wrong with me for not caring about the stuff, or like I'm not able to tap into my emotions, but I haven't been able to uncover anything. Maybe I can journal on it some more tonight and see what I can uncover about.

Speaker 2:

Why are my feelings? Not hurt by the internet bullies. Do you think if it was a different time in your life, you would have been more affected by what's happening right now on the internet towards you?

Speaker 1:

I mean definitely, but I don't know how affected.

Speaker 1:

Like I definitely I'm sure it would affect me more when I was younger and less secure in like the life I had created for myself.

Speaker 1:

But I'm not sure if it would have a devastating impact because I've never really taken myself too seriously, like one of the things that I do think I've always done well is be able to make fun of myself and have humility and not take myself too seriously. So I think for that reason it would not go against my character to like care too much about this thing. And there has been videos random like if I'm thinking about it now random videos in the past or photos that are like hilarious, like I remember I was I haven't thought about this before, but like when I was trying to run for like res in first year, I like res president or whatever, I pasted around a photo of myself on with like a crown, shirtless, on some sort of beanbag chair and like put it all around the res and it worked. But like it's a similar thing where it's like cringy, embarrassing but also hilarious. So I guess that goes to show that I've been able to, yeah, just make fun of myself for a while.

Speaker 2:

What about someone who making fun of themselves is a challenge? Sound that easy for them to not take themselves? Not seriously the way you are, and they are dealing with bullying, or they are dealing with social media trolls? Do you have any advice that you can pass on now that you've been trolled and been famous for a moment in time?

Speaker 1:

Well, the main thing that I technique, that I use in general to not have things bother me very often is that, almost to a T, the person who's reacting to you or making fun of you it's their own problem, like somebody who's secure and happy and healthy as a person, in my opinion, wouldn't feel the need to put somebody else down in order to make them self feel more secure.

Speaker 1:

So anytime that somebody's, yeah, being doing any of this bullying, I think about the same, and even myself, like when I think when I catch myself gossiping or trying to comment on somebody else, I'm like okay, why am I feeling the need to comment on somebody else's life? What about their life? Do I want? Or what about my life? Am I not secure about? That would make me feel the need to put somebody else down to make me feel better, and I think that's helpful for anyone who's getting bullied, or just helpful for anyone in life to just think about that. Whenever you feel the need to comment or question somewhat, somebody else is doing like why does it matter to you?

Speaker 2:

The finger that points.

Speaker 1:

It's very true it always comes back.

Speaker 2:

It's so annoying and it's maddening when it happens to us, but it always comes back on you for sure.

Speaker 1:

Luckily you never point the finger at me, so it never goes back to you.

Speaker 2:

There was one person in particular who came to your defense, a celebrity, johnny Bones. Johnny is a UFC heavyweight champion with over 60 million followers on TikTok, another 8 million on Instagram. He came to your defense in the comments telling people to leave you alone and that they were being cruel. Did somebody so high profile coming to your defense like that, like, did that feel good?

Speaker 1:

I can't say I gave it a lot of thought, to be honest. I know you mentioned the famous guy like reposted it in defense, but I didn't really give it a lot more thought than that. I'm being honest. But it's great, I appreciate, like shout out to Johnny Bones, Like I appreciate that I guess, yeah, thinking about it, it's great to have someone famous have your back.

Speaker 2:

Does this experience change your opinion about social media?

Speaker 1:

I wouldn't say it changes my opinion about social media. I'd say it changes my opinion, although I go back and forth a bit because we did end up getting into like its own echo chamber bubble of these like extreme right wing fishermen, buff people, because originally I was like, if this is what the masses look like, it's less motivating to try to do things to be better and help the world and these types of things like this is the type of vibe that is around that we don't see. But I think I still don't have enough data points to prove that. Like I think this just entered its own negative echo chamber, but there's also many other good echo chambers we haven't yet entered.

Speaker 1:

So I wouldn't say it changes my opinion of social media, because this is what I saw social media as like ridiculous videos go famous all the time. I get them put at me in my Instagram feed Often. I set you one yesterday of somebody like grooming their dog for like 10 minutes, but on fast feed and I watched it and liked it and you hear about all the haters anyway. So like it was actually kind of fun to be actually trolled. Like I hear about the trolls. I'd never seen the trolls. It's not like I look at comments very often or like look at the Reddit threads around these things, like so it was funny to actually see trolling, but it doesn't really change my opinion.

Speaker 2:

Well, that's a good segue for how I want to end this interview, with a bit of a speed round. So the trolls have made a number of assumptions or statements about who you are and I thought we could end with you speed round, letting them know if it's true or not. You ready? Okay, speed round. Quick answers. Do you drive a Subaru?

Speaker 1:

No, but I wanted to.

Speaker 2:

Have you ever been to a clay studio?

Speaker 1:

No.

Speaker 2:

Have you ever made it with a man?

Speaker 1:

No.

Speaker 2:

Would you?

Speaker 1:

I wouldn't put it off the table, but I'm not seeking it out.

Speaker 2:

Do you sit down to pee?

Speaker 1:

Sometimes yeah.

Speaker 2:

Do you identify as liberal?

Speaker 1:

Yes.

Speaker 2:

Are you scared of your own shadow?

Speaker 1:

Definitely not.

Speaker 2:

Have you ever been pegged?

Speaker 1:

No.

Speaker 2:

Would you be willing to be pegged?

Speaker 1:

No, I don't think so.

Speaker 2:

Would you be willing to peg someone else?

Speaker 1:

Like you Again, like I'm not seeking it out, but I wouldn't put it off the table.

Speaker 2:

Did you ever have an official man card?

Speaker 1:

That is a stumped. I would need to see a better definition of the man card. But like I don't want to claim a man card, I don't know enough about it. But Are you a city boy?

Speaker 2:

No, are you a soy boy? I would, yeah.

Speaker 1:

I think that's. I've thought about it and I think I am a soy boy. Are you gay?

Speaker 2:

No, and finally, are you a man, I am a man.

Speaker 1:

Jared, thank you so much.

Speaker 2:

For coming on the Freedom Lifestyle podcast, setting the record straight, responding to the haters, breaking your silence. A month of comments, DMs, people going back into your photos from like 10 years ago, chirping you, and you haven't even felt the urge to respond to a single one of them. Thank you for giving me the exclusive. Thank you, Sam, it's always a pleasure.

Speaker 1:

I'm sad the interviews over, but we'll have to chat afterwards. Great Bye, bye.

Speaker 2:

Thanks for tuning in to another episode.

Speaker 2:

If you like what you heard today, you got some value, some inspiration, maybe some clarity on your next step. Please consider supporting the show and also fueling my caffeine addiction. You can now make donations to the Freedom Lifestyle podcast at buymeacoffeecom slash what's your free. That's buymeacoffeecom slash what's your free. Every one of your coffee contributions not only helps keep me energized. What I'm producing this content, but it also really helps remind me that what I'm creating here is valuable and it is helping people and it is worth continuing. So until next time, freedom Seekers, enjoy your freedom.

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Sam Laliberte

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